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International Musician and Recording World
June 1979 - Cover Story: Stephen Stills
by Steven Rosen
Discussing the music of Stephen Stills is really an examination
of the fundamental history of American rock and roll. Through
his affiliations with the Buffalo Springfield, Crosby, Stills,
Nash and Young, and Manassas, he worked with such luminaries as
Richie Furay, Jim Messina, Neil Young, David Crosby, Eric Clapton,
Jimi Hendrix, and many others.
So, when one refers to Stills, one is talking about a man who
has had a strong hand in shaping the music we hear today. It is
senseless to try and analyze the music and words he has written.
Songs like, "For What It'a Worth," and "Love the One You're With,"
have become virtual standards, outlining the importance of his
music once again.
Some gold records at Stephen's home. ©
But the impact created by his guitar playing is a different story
altogether. The notes fall helter skelter from his fingers and
if one were to liken his style to a city skyline, his would most
likely resemble New York's. It rises and dips and disappears and
there is no order to it.
In the following conversation he describes his special guitar
playing techniques and recording methods.
Q: When and why did you first start playing? Tell me about your
first guitars and that whole early period.
A: I started out a drummer when I was six and I had my first job
by the time I was eight. I was always in school bands and stuff
like that. I picked up the guitar somewhere along there - I must
have been eight or nine. My first guitar was a Kay, then I had
an Epiphone, a Guild twelve string acoustic/electric guitar, and
a strange electric monstrosity like Muddy Waters used to play
- with all the knobs and stuff. It was a Silvertone or something
like that. I played a little bit of bass in a band with a Fender
Precision. I've always used a Fender Precision.I sang in choirs
and folk groups, did plays in school and took some piano lessons.
Went to a Catholic school and when I finished my lessons, I was
pounding away at that good old boogie woogie music at age 11 or
12. This old priest on a retreat stuck his head out the door and
said, "Oh, don't stop, I was just going to remind you not to break
the piano." He used to sit outside reading his prayer book and
listen to me play. I used to listen to the Gregorian chants which
gave me some sense of harmony.
Q: Did you ever have guitar lesssons?
A: Not with the guitar, but with everything else. I gave guitar
lessons. As soon as I learned a couple of chords from some friends,
I took off. I started hanging around with a couple of servicemen
from McDiller Air Force Base and some of the Marines that were
stationed in Latin America. Most of the music that I use, I learned
from black guys.
Q: Were you listening to records or other guitar players?
A: Oh yeah. I was listening to a radio station called WLAC from
Nashville. It's a big soul, R&B, and gospel station - covered the whole south. I used to listen to that all the
time.
Q: Blues stuff?
A: Yeah.
Q: What was your first real introduction to rock?
A: I was playing rock n' roll during the mid '50's. The first
rock n' roll show I saw was Buddy Holly and the Tides, those kinds
of bands. I was living in Gainesville, Florida and there were
all these great black showbands playing in the fraternity houses.
I had lots of friends and we'd go wherever the best band was playing.
I was listening to Little Walter and Little Willie John. BB King
was out there, Freddie King was around, Chicago blues players,
people like that. I still remember the lyrics of some Jimmy Reed
songs. It was always impossible to pick up the lyrics. I was working
in rock bands before the Beatles came out. Jimi Hendrix was a
year younger than I am. He and I started hanging out together
when he came over for Monterey. We went over to my place at the
beach and played for two days. We must have made up about four
albums of actual songs and the cops came by and said, "don't be
alarmed, we're just going to listen 'cause it's just as groovy
to sit here and listen while we get our calls, as it is to sit
on top of the hill." Sure enough, there were three Highway Patrolmen
and two Sheriff cars sitting out there digging it.
Q: Do you think you actually learned from him? Would he sit down
and show you actual things?
A: Yeah. He gave me a left handed Stratocaster that somebody had
given him, because he said Stratocasters played better upside
down - which is why he never used a left-handed Stratocaster,
he always used a righthanded one upside down.
Q: Then he played on that one track on your first solo album (Old
Times Good Times - Stephen Stills Atlantic SD7202)
A: Yeah. He played on that and I played on a couple of his songs.
I don't know if they ever credited me in the liner notes, but
I played on about two or three of his tracks.
Q: Was Springfield the first band were you thought your playing
was taking shape?
A: Well. Springfield was mainly a band that I formed, it just
sort of came together by accident. Richie Furay and I were trying
to get a band together just to practice songs. We ran into Neil
and his bass player (Bruce Palmer), got a drummer (Dewey Martin)
and went to town.
Q: What kind of instrument were you using in the Springfield?
A: I had a Twin Reverb with a Showman bottom cabinet and I used
the reverb to run both of them.
Q: What kind of guitar were you using?
A: I was using a Guild, then I got a Les Paul. I got a three-pickup
model and had the middle pickup taken out.
Q: Why?
A: Made the other two more powerful It was a very powerful guitar.
Q: Were you using those guitars on the album?
A: Yeah. Gretsches too. Lots of them.
Q: You've always used alot of hollow-body guitars.
A: Yeah for the most part. Then I got the feel of the solid body
guitar. Never could use Fenders. Couldn't get the feel for them.
Now I use Firebirds. Eric Clapton lent me one of his. It used
to drive him crazy because he couldn't keep it in tune, so I hit
upon the idea of putting banjo pegs on it. I bought three of them
and had bango pegs put on all of them.
Q: It worked?
A: Yeah, it really works fine now.
Q: Is that the one you used for the show at the Roxy? What year
is that?
A: It's about a '59 or '60, if that. Probably earlier.
Q: Have you had any other work done to them, rewiring?
A: No, not a thing. As little as I can possibly do.
Q: What is it about them that you like?
A: The touch. It hasn't got the "fretless wonder" feel. It has
a broad fret that's cut fairly deep so I can dig in pretty well.
If I keep them smooth and clean, then they go as fast as I need
to go.
Q: On the first Springfield album (Buffalo Springfield - Atco
SD33-200A), it said on the liner notes, "Stephen Stills 2nd lead
guitar, Neil Young lead guitar." Was that accurate at that point?
A: Yeah I suppose so. I was trading leads with him.
Q: You think he rubbed off on you or vice versa?
A: I'm sure he did. And I am sure it was vice versa.
Q: You like playing with other guitarist?
A: Yeah if they are good. The trouble with most lead guitar players
is that they can't play rhythm. I know about five and they all
play real good rhythm; Eric, Donny..... Donny Felder and I played
in a band in high school in Gainsville, Florida in '62.
Q: What about Townshend?
A: Townshend's great, but he's into a whole other bag. I love
to play with Joe Walsh, Don Felder, Eric and George Terry, the
guy that plays with Eric. Somehow the best guitar players I know
can play really good rhythm.
Q: When did you start collecting guitars?
A: After Crosby, Stills and Nash my guitar collection began to
grow by leaps and bounds. I started to buy everything within sight
- put the money right back into my instruments. I bought the greatest
Hammond B3 organ known to man. I just called up the dealer in
New York and said, "I want a B3 that I can kill." I told him to
take all the settings and turn them all the way up. He gave me
some beefed up drivers because I kept blowing them. Paid cash
for it - the whole shot, it was like $4100. and I haven't played
one to match it since.
Stephen admist some of his collection. Notice the giraffe in he
corner? ©
Q: Tell me about some of the guitars you have purchased. I know
there 's quite a few.
A: What I'll do is show you a couple. The black Les Paul I had
is gone. I've had a couple of priceless pieces stolen.
Q: How come you always travel with so many guitars?
A: The acoustics I travel with are for open tunings. But I only
use three in the electric part of the set. At the Roxy I only
used two.
Q: What kind of guitars were you using with Crosby, Stills and
Nash?
A: Same ones. I just tried to eliminate as many devices as possible.
I used a Vox Pedal and a wireless. I've put a wah-wah into my
system now but I don't use it that much. Used to use one all the
time, then got away from it.
Q: So you're just using the two Gibson Firebirds on stage now?
A: Yeah. I've got a double-neck that I keep in back.
Q: What kind?
A: The old black Gibson double-neck with a 6-string and a little
mandolin short string. It's really good. Then I've got a prototype
Gibson12 and 6. I'm having it reworked right now. I've almost
got an entire collection of pre-war Martin D-45's.
Q: What acoustics do you use on stage?
A: I use a Herringbone D-28 and a D-45. I try to leave my D-45's
at home, but I just can't play anything else, so I take my old
ones with me and buy a seat on the airplane.
Q; What kind of amps are you using?
A: I bought five or six Marshall 100-watt tops and a whole bank
of speaker cabinets, all of them with those Celestion speakers,
the good stuff. I figured out which one I liked best and then
I did what Jimi did. Went up to this crazy character in Brooklyn,
took all my tops and we went inside and picked out the one I liked
the best, listened to the capacitors and resistors and everything
and whatever was missing we put back in and whatever was there
but needed replacing, we took out, so they're all quite the same.
Q: So do you use just one stack?
A: I use the top cabinets, two of those on the floor, side by
side. I don't use the bottom cabinet because it would be too loud.
This works out to be just the right volume.
Q: So you just use one head?
A: Yeah, I use one head and those two top cabinets. It works pretty
nice.
Q:What kinds of settings do you normally use on the amp?
A: With a flick of a finger, I want to be able to put it into
distortion and then turn it down where it gets that crystalline
clarity to it.
Q: Your guitars have always had that kind of sound.
A: Yeah. It's really a question of the guitar and amp being on
7 or 8 and I just use the volume knob to about 8, then it's crystal
clear. Then I flip it up to 10 and it's a muddy sound.
Q: Do you ever use a guitar pick?
A: No, never have.
Q: Was it like that when you first started playing?
A: I used fingerpicks. Found it impossible to play lead guitar
with fingerpicks, so the result is an enormous callous.
Q: Have you ever heard of other guitar players doing that?
A: Well.... except for guys that play classical style - that's
the way I play bass - I haven't seen anybody do that, no.
Q: Do you find you're able to get enough speed with your fingers?
A: I have to be very careful, otherwise it turns to slop. But,
yeah. I can pretty much get enough speed. I can use flat picks,
but they just don't do it for me.
Q: So when you play chords you're just fingerpicking?
A: Yeah, I'll do that.
Q: Did studying scaled help you?
A: I never do that. I work at finding a new scale, but licks turn
into lines, which turn into runs, which turns into nausea.
Q: So you don't practice?
A: I can't practice by myself. It's boring. I practice with the
band playing, then I'll play what I know.
Q: Can you describe your right hand technique? You're better known
for your acoustic stuff more than anything else.
A:Where’s my name in the Playboy Jazz and Pop Poll? Get ready
folks, 20 years from now...That’s accident more than anything,
but I definitely have a distinctive style. I’m just starting to
master the instrument now.
Q: You consider fingerpicking like playing a bass?
A: Yeah.
Q: It must be a difficult thing to do.
A: When I play lead I just play as if I had a flat pick in my
finger, only I use my finger and I keep it turned down.
Q: Are there any examples on record that showcase your fingerpick
style?
A: Thoroughfare Gap is a perfect example. A classic example.
Q: Do you use any special techniques in the studio to record your
guitars? Your acoustic guitar sound is always distinguishable.
A: Yes, but it’s called priviledged information. I’m not at liberty
to say. A non-denial denial. A lot of it has to do electronic
techniques. It’s very, very, simple and we’ve been using them
for years, but more than 90 percent of it has to do with my touch
and the particular instruments that I use. You don’t take a 50-year
old guitar, do that to it and try to have it just come out singing
like that. Try it with a brand new one and it won’t sound like
the same instrument at all.
Q: Does it take you more thatn one run-through before you come
up with a solo track that you’re pleased with?
A: No more than three. Unless the band’s untogether, then it gets
to the point of diminishing returns. I have a starting and an
ending point and I try to leave myself free. I don’t plan my guitar
solos. I compose the structure around which my guitar solo will
revolve, but other than that, it’s whatever falls off the fingers,
because the accidental stuff is what makes it. It’s really silly
to sit there and learn this guitar solo over and over and over.
That’s one of the things JImi taught me. You don’t do that - when
you do, you start becoming pendantic. You may have a whole melody,
but that's not jazz. Jazz is free-form. You may have a starting
scale or a scale you want to lead the band back into and that's
their cue.
But what happens in between, man, has got to be "eveybody being
in tune with everybody." If I'm at two and we want to go to three,
I want the drummer to kick the six/eight in. Six is great to play
to. Everybody can make that change right there. Everybody looks
at each other and says, 'yeah,' and there it is. Or you can be
playing in four and be in a shuffle. That's the kind of stuff
I look for, that's the kind of adeptness I look for. I just try
to form the structure if we're getting into a jam. That gives
me the ability to sing different kinds of melodies with a different
singing style.
But the electric guitar is my favorite, because I can do more
with it. I can get the same sensitivity that I can get out of
an acoustic guitar. I can turn it down just as soft. Did it the
other night at the Roxy, it was the second to last show. Some
guy was saying "yeah, great, we get to hear some acoustic Stills."
I played the first song and the guy kept carrying on, "boy am
I glad to hear you play acoustic" and stuff. And I said, "listen,
I can get those other things to sound just the same, wanna see?"
Then I walked over and got my guitar, turned it down low and sang
another song, and it was just as effective. I can fingerpick on
either with the light gauge rock and roll strings, it just requires
a lighter touch. But the acoustic guitar will never be replaced.
I'm at the point where I can certainly adapt what I want to do
from the acoustic guitar, but not vice-versa. You've got to be
able to play the blues on the acoustic guitar before you can get
that kind of control on the electric. Otherwise you go crazy,
because the acoustic guitar is limiting. It's a big, stiff instrument
and it's great for fingerpicking.
There are guitars where because of the chording technique and
the attack on the G string, when you play a D chord, it'll get
out of tune. So I use a Gretsch with the biggest strings, a wound
third string. Solves the whole problem. Once they start putting
pickups on my 50-year old guitars, rather than using the damn
microphone, I don't care if it's the Forum or Yankee Stadium,
once they start doing that, I might as well play on the electric
guitar, where I know what's going to happen. The difference in
sound is not that great. They put an eight-ounce piece of plastic
in the sound-hole of my 58-year old Martin D-45 - which is worth
about $15,000.-$20,000. - to make is sound good in the hall. And
I said, "Hang on. Wait just one minute here. You've got this all
wrong. Your job is to reproduce that sound in the hall, the sound
of that instrument." I paid $6000. dollars for a guitar that was
not really worth it, but they only made 125 before World War II.
I have two of the best that they made. It's as simple as that.
The sound man's job is not to mess with that. Find a little contact
pickup if you want, but use it in conjunction with the microphone.
In the studio, I use a Neumann 87 or a Telefunken, or an AKG,
or a 546, or all four to reproduce the sound of this particular
guitar. There are some other devices used the way I set my limiters.
What kind of limiters I use, what kind of equalization, how much
Poltec and how much of that, those are my main trade secrets.
Where the trick is, which all the engineers and producers lose
sight of, is that you have to reproduce a guitar.
Q: Does direct-to-disc interest you at all?
A: Yes, except for human error. The costs can be enormous.
Q: Because those masters wear out after a few thousand copies?
I heard you have to cut three or four masters to print so many
thousand copies, because one master won't work. They lose their
quality.
A: The mother won't last. That's the biggest problem we have right
now. No, the biggest problem we have right now is that quality
of the vinyl we have to deal with. God help you if you want to
make a clear record. They'll come unglued because they can no
longer scrape the bottom of the barrel for the petroleum compounds
needed for polyethylene vinyl-chloride. Plus the fact that government
restrictions for polyethylene vinyl-chloride have put the boogie
man in the wrong place as far as I'm concerned. Instead of creating
machinery to make the substance safe to deal with, i.e. through
a gas mask or a suit or something like that, they simply eliminate
it. The result is all the cruddy records with hair in them and
records where I, knowing what I know about this industry, plan
for what I'm going to lose on the weighted disc when I mix. When
I record, even.
Q: Are there any particular recorded solos you've done that stand
out in your mind?
A: The best solos I've done have been live. On the last CSN tour,
there were three or four places where I got standing ovations
for my guitar solos. I didn't believe it the first time and it
had to happen a few more times before I felt it wasn't a fluke.
I don't know if I've ever done anything outstanding. The one that
comes to mind is "Questions," the original version of "Questions,"
"Fishes and Scorpions," "Go Back Home," and "Black Queen," electric.
I don't know if that's been recorded. I thought that Bill Graham
was recording it when I did the gig with Dylan in Houston, because
I really just burned it down. I don't know, in the last year and
a half my guitar playing has grown to a point where I can't tell
anymore. But what I've done on record is definitely not up to
where I get to on stage. On Thoroughfare Gap, there's some good
solos - "Not Fade Away," has a nice sound. There’s a good solo
on Low Down, because it’s live. Actually, all the guitar solos
on the album are done live. That’s the latest deal, to do the
guitar solo while we’re doing the track. If I screw it up, if
there is a chance to punch in where a string fell off my finger,
I’ll do it, but other than that, I really like to go for it live.
Sometimes I’ll edit between takes to maintain that live quality.
Q: How did you feel about your playing on the live album (Stephen
Stills Live)?
A: Not that stupendous. I haven’t really been captured live yet.
I’ve had to deal with alot of different elements, other people
in the band, me over singing and so on. I laid down my money and
did the four days at the Roxy and from what I’ve heard - you can
hear the beginnings of this chest cold I have and it’s a little
raw and raggedy - but the band is powerful and my playing is real
clean and I don’t think I’ve missed anything. I didn’t miss a
bend or a lick the whole weekend. In one respect, that can mean
being overcautious and I’m certainly not the master of my instrument
yet, but that’s what I want to be. One can only hope to attain
the state where they can really fly and not miss, because there’s
a certain place where mistakes are just not part of your universe.
Mistakes become so subliminal, people don’t notice them. You don’t
make mistakes, you don’t screw up.
Q: How long ago did you start playing slide?
A: I’ve been trying to learn slide for about six years. JOE WALSH
first taught me the touch, but it’s still hard for me and I’m
just getting to where I can be more consistent, because slide
guitar can be the most wonderful sounding guitar in the world,
or the worst. I’m still very paranoid about my slide playing.
I know what I want to play, but I’m not a master.
Q: What kind of slide do you use?
A: I use a glass one. I have a particular setting on the white
Firebird that works for slide. I put it on the front pickup and
take the top down to about 3 or 4 and the level down to about
8 or 9. The trick with slide is that the intonation comes when
you get the contact of the slide right on top of the object fret.
The movement becomes fluid rather than real jerky. Everybody can
do that but it’s hard to do it fluidly. People I know have picked
it up naturally and gotten down to it right away. I’ve tried many
times and failed miserably. I really want to do a great slide
solo in the studio and it just comes out like shit, unadulterated
crap. It’s embarrassing, but you just keep going at it until it
gets there.
Q: You use a regular guitar tuning when you play slide?
A: Yeah, that’s the other thing. There’s no sense in using off-the-wall
tunings for slide, particularly on electric. There are some great
scales to be had behind that, but I don’t know. I just use straight
tunings so I know where it’s supposed to go. I’m sure I’ll discover
tunings and that’ll just mean another guitar that’s tuned to another
tuning. I want to eliminate as many of those as I can.
Q: You do use a lot of tunings for acoustic stuff?
A: Yeah, basically three. I use a funny kind of a tuning that
Bruce Palmer and I came up with a long time ago. I’ve written
a lot of songs in that tuning because it’s very easy. Low E, low
E, middle E, middle E, B, and high E. That’s all there is to it.
The result is all kinds of places to work and all kinds of funny
chords. I use a D modal, which is both E strings tuned down to
D and I use another D tuning where only the bottom string is tuned
to D and that’s about it.
Q: What kind of strings do you use?
A: I use Fender Rock ‘n’ Rolls, light gauge or extra-light gauge
and bronze Earthworks for my acoustics I have one set of pre-CBS
Fender flatwounds for my basses. I use “silk and steels,” and
Savarez for my Spanish guitar. When I do use a flat pick, I usually
use a thin one and my fingers to play bass. Rotosound bass strings
aren’t bad. I keep bass strings on for a year, if not longer,
and that’s about all.
Stephen on keys. Stephen, bring back the piano at your gigs! ©
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